Previously, on Are You There, God? It's Me, Atheist...
In a pulse-pounding thrill ride, full of dramatic twists and outrageous turns, we discussed the first of three sets of questions which have left many a faith shattered in their wake. While these once-mighty questions may or may not hold quite as much sway for me now, I still think they can provide a fertility clinic for fruitful discussion-babies. And now, for your consideration, a few more of the questions.
4. What is the relationship between science and religion? If, as many theists claim, science actually supports religious claims rather than debunking them, why is the NAS (the National Academy of Science, the most eminent and honored collection of scientists on the planet) comprised of about 70-90% atheists and/or agnostics? Furthermore, if reason and logic (the tools of philosophy) support religious claims rather than undermining them, why are most philosophers atheists? (Again, over 70% atheists, less than 15% theists, and a little over 12% "other.") Not that I think this solves the matter; but if the numbers were reversed, it would certainly give me pause. I would at least feel the need to re-evaluate my position on this issue.
In a pulse-pounding thrill ride, full of dramatic twists and outrageous turns, we discussed the first of three sets of questions which have left many a faith shattered in their wake. While these once-mighty questions may or may not hold quite as much sway for me now, I still think they can provide a fertility clinic for fruitful discussion-babies. And now, for your consideration, a few more of the questions.
4. What is the relationship between science and religion? If, as many theists claim, science actually supports religious claims rather than debunking them, why is the NAS (the National Academy of Science, the most eminent and honored collection of scientists on the planet) comprised of about 70-90% atheists and/or agnostics? Furthermore, if reason and logic (the tools of philosophy) support religious claims rather than undermining them, why are most philosophers atheists? (Again, over 70% atheists, less than 15% theists, and a little over 12% "other.") Not that I think this solves the matter; but if the numbers were reversed, it would certainly give me pause. I would at least feel the need to re-evaluate my position on this issue.
5. What do you think of God's moral character as depicted in the Bible? How can you respect and worship the God of the Old Testament, with his numerous commands of so-called "heroic genocide?" For that matter, how can you respect and worship the God of the New Testament who casts those deemed unworthy (for such heinous offenses as unbelief, which is a thought-crime) into eternal hell-fire and damnation? (Please refrain from saying we atheists send ourselves to hell. No one would purposefully choose to touch a scalding hot burner for even a minute, much less leap--of one's own volition--into a burning lake of fire, hotter than any fire on earth, for all eternity. Besides, atheists are simply attempting to be intellectually honest. We just don't see enough evidence to concede belief in the existence of God. Same rules apply to Zeus and all other deities/supernatural entities for whom there isn't sufficient positive evidence.) Please be careful in answering this question. I find it most disturbing when Christians rationalize genocide. Many of my Christian friends try to answer this question by telling me the Bible stories involved with the Old Testament genocides, assuring me that God had a reason for them. Know that I'm quite familiar with these stories. ('Round the World Snaps!) And having a "reason" does not make it morally acceptable or morally advantageous behavior. Many murderers claim to have a "reason" for their behavior. I won't belabor the point any further, but I'm sure you're aware of people committing morally reprehensible acts claiming to have a "reason" for them. Rationalizing past genocides is dangerous. It invites the application of similar reasoning to future actions. (If you take the claims made in the Bible seriously and believe in the goodness of the God it describes, then Christians must be committed to the view that heinous acts are morally right, as God performs and/or commands them all over the place in the Bible.) It also reveals a profound callousness for those who suffered and died and lost family members at God’s command. Also, how can morally reprehensible acts (such as these genocides, etc.) be reconciled with what Jesus supposedly taught about turning the other cheek, loving your neighbor and enemy as yourself, and the golden rule?
6. Can you disprove the existence of gods you don't believe in? Suppose you met a person who actually still believed in the existence of Zeus. How would you go about disproving the existence of such an entity? Assuming you would make an appeal to reason and evidence rather than faith and the Bible (otherwise it's just your faith against his, your Holy Word against his), how is it that your God is immune to such disproof? How would the logical arguments you brought to bear against the existence of Zeus not backfire and work against the Christian God as well?
I like big questions and I can not lie
You theologians can't deny
When an atheist walks in with a problem for your faith
And you gotta ask God for grace
You get stung!
So Uhh! Double up...Uhh! Uhh!
You know the name.
#6 evokes Russell's teapot (or the Flying Spaghetti Monster if you prefer). How does one even go about disproving something? Sure, you've got modus tollens in your arsenal, but that doesn't strike me a particularly potent weapon against deity existence, unless you can get your opponent to state every argument as a logical inference.
ReplyDeleteThe bottom line is, I can't disprove the existence of Zeus any more than I can disprove the teapot; it's up to the believer to prove Zeus does exist. The burden of proof lies with the claimant.
Hello Anonymous, whose name I like totes for rillz don't even know and stuff.
DeleteGood points. Agreed. What is it they say about great minds and all that jazz.
But be careful with the Latin. Stuff's dangerous. Could hurt somebody.
Peace out home-skillet.
-Rev. Berty P. Russmuffin
As withthe usual athesist..your reasoning is dysfunctional and so biased you cannot see even elementary truths.
ReplyDeleteHere's how absurd your logic is.
Did you know 75% of Doctors believe in God?
According to your no sequitar conclusions...I say it when a science scholarship is handed out humans who want to care for the sick choose Medicine and people who dont care about the sick choose Cosmology.
Not that we have established that you've demented the facts to suit what you Want to believe...did it ever occur to you that those with high science scores have a choice to make in disciplines with their scholarships?
Did it ever occur to you that studies show atheists overwhelmingly choose fields that have to do with Origins .and Theists, who already feel they have an answer to origins go into Medicine, radiology, nursing, or other feilds that seek dont seek to find meaning with their lives instead?
Well thats what every study show mr wizard. Its freaking common sense. I suppose you think people who enter liberal arts media and journalism just happen to turn liberal too.
Maybe Death metal bands turn atheists from their occupation. Perhaps Porn moguls, serial killers, herion addicts, and even Stalin learned on the job as well.
Look, you can surround yourself all day with what your itching ears want to hear and live under a pile of incoherent arguments, or even enter one of the fields of Origins that atheists flock to so they can have a religion...but we're all looking at you through the zoo cage bars and it ain't pretty bro